What brought the towers down???

[Ulysses]

Some of the representatives of this Zionist CD theory seem more intent on preventing any real discussion of facts and more interested in steering opposition to the official story into a dead end street (mini-nukes, holograms, etc.) It's almost as if they are trying to derail the "truth movement" by hijacking it and by espousing the most ridiculous theories they can come up with. They also try to bully everyone who doesn't agree into accepting their group think.

"Ask yourself, who benefits?"

Who benefits? Those who actually committed crimes. By distracting "truthers" and by using lies and red herrings (the dancing "Mossad agents") they lead them on wild-goose chases and keep them from actually asking the tough questions and going after the real crimes.

So it seems, whether intentional or not, the effect of their actions is to weaken any legitimate effort to find out what really happened. The effect of their actions is that opposition to the official story is effectively derailed and turned into mockery, while the guilty parties walk away.

It seems the real shills are not those questioning the CD dogma. The real shills are the ones browbeating everyone into accepting their Jewish conspiracy, Mossad agents, mini-nuke CD dogmas and therefore preventing any serious opposition to the official story from gaining credibility.

And of course, they'd probably be posing as twoofers as well...

[Merlin]

If that is really what they want then why do they call us names when we question some of their beliefs? Isnt a real investigation in to truth all about asking the hard questions?

There is more than enough name calling on Internet forums to go around on all sides. I don't know what it is about the medium; but otherwise mature adults shoot of their mouths in ways they would never do in face-to-face discussions. It's almost an online version of road rage.

If you don't believe me, go take a look at what's going on in the Ron Paul Blimp subforum (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/forumdisplay.php?f=208.) Not productive behavior at all.

[Kahlil Gibran]

The real shills are the ones browbeating everyone into accepting their Jewish conspiracy, Mossad agents

38305

Kissinger resigns as head of 9/11 commission

Friday, December 13, 2002

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Facing questions about potential conflicts of interest, Henry Kissinger resigned Friday as chairman of the September 11 commission.

President Bush named Kissinger to lead the 10-member commission last month, dropping his longstanding opposition to an independent probe of the events leading up to the September 11 terrorist attacks.

In a letter to the president, Kissinger, 79, said he was stepping down from the appointment to remove any questions about even the appearance of a conflict of interest regarding his ties to several organizations and public figures.

An administration official said Kissinger also called White House Chief of Staff Andrew Card Friday afternoon to talk about his withdrawal from the position. The official would not say if the call was expected, but aides said the president was surprised by Kissinger's decision.

In his letter, Kissinger said he was prepared to submit all relevant financial information to the White House and an independent review, as well as to other members of the joint commission.

"It has become clear, however, that although specific potential conflicts can be resolved in this manner, the controversy would quickly move to the consulting firm I have built and own," Kissinger's letter said.

"To liquidate Kissinger Associates cannot be accomplished without significantly delaying the beginning of the joint commission's work," he added. "I have, therefore, concluded that I cannot accept the responsibility you have proposed."

The concern is the questions of conflict of interest that may be raised because the former secretary of state serves on the boards of several organizations, and is chairman of some of them.

Kissinger was national security adviser and later secretary of state under President Nixon. After Nixon's resignation in 1974, Kissinger continued as secretary of state under President Ford.

Henry Kissinger
Age: 79; born May 27, 1923, in Germany
Career highlights: U.S. secretary of state, 1973-1977; national security adviser, 1969-1975; shared the Nobel Peace Prize with North Vietnamese counterpart Le Duc Tho; author, professor and Army veteran
Personal: As a child, fled Nazi Germany in 1938 with family to the United States; married to Nancy Marginnes; two adult children from previous marriage

President Bush, in a brief statement, said he accepted Kissinger's decision "with regret."

"As I stated at the time of his appointment, Dr. Kissinger is one of our nation's most accomplished and respected public servants. I thank him for his willingness to consider serving this country once again," the president's statement said.

Bush promised he would select a new chairman for the commission soon.

Kissinger's appointment was criticized by some who said he was too close to powerful national and international figures to be independent. In an editorial published November 29, The New York Times suggested the White House chose him "to contain an investigation it has long opposed."

It's the second resignation from the commission in two days. Wednesday, former Sen. George Mitchell announced he was stepping down as vice chairman of the independent board.

In his letter, Mitchell also cited potential conflicts of interest. He said he didn't want to sever ties with his law firm, which he said he had been urged to do, and he said the commission's work would take too much time.

"I regret that I will not be able to serve," the former Senate Majority leader wrote.

Former Rep. Lee Hamilton, D-Indiana, will replace Mitchell.

http://archives.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLITICS/12/13/kissinger.resigns/

You crack me up Ulysses. In another thread you slandered a well-respected tenured California University professor, Kevin MacDonald, and here you are now defending Henry Kissinger "investigating" Mossad involvement in 9-11. You never did tell us about yourself...always refused to share who you really are and why you chime in all the Zionist threads...

:haha:

[Ulysses]

You crack me up Ulysses. In another thread you slandered a well-respected tenured California University professor, Kevin MacDonald, and here you are now defending Henry Kissinger "investigating" Mossad involvement in 9-11. You never did tell us about yourself...always refused to share who you really are and why you chime in all the Zionist threads...


Again, throwing a rock while accusing someone else of throwing a rock.

Where in any of my posts am I "defending Henry Kissinger" doing anything? As to Kevin MacDonald, how does the fact that I posted his wiki profile constitute slander? Now you've repeatedly demonstrated yourself to be the liar.

As to who I am, at least the first time you asked, back when I didn't know you were not to be taken seriously, I told you I was raised Catholic. Yet you refuse to confirm or deny your assertions as Geltman and Goldman that you are jewish.

So you know about me, yet say nothing about you. You ask plenty of questions, most of them irrelevant, but refuse to answer any. What's the deal, "KG"? Are you no man at all?

[Infidel]

Dancing Cubanas

<object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/gawrOAZAotg&rel=1"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/gawrOAZAotg&rel=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>

[Christopher]

:s9: :s9: :s9:

[johngr]

It seems the real shills are not those questioning the CD dogma. The real shills are the ones browbeating everyone into accepting their Jewish conspiracy, Mossad agents, mini-nuke CD dogmas and therefore preventing any serious opposition to the official story from gaining credibility.

What did these Mossad agents http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=212280 have planned?

[mactheknf]

What did these Mossad agents http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=212280 have planned?


Do you know what Stay On Topic means ?

[Kahlil Gibran]

It seems the real shills are not those questioning the CD dogma.

http://goldismoney.info/forums/showpost.php?p=888605&postcount=1

[Ulysses]

Again, throwing a rock while accusing someone else of throwing a rock.

Where in any of my posts am I "defending Henry Kissinger" doing anything? As to Kevin MacDonald, how does the fact that I posted his wiki profile constitute slander? Now you've repeatedly demonstrated yourself to be the liar.

As to who I am, at least the first time you asked, back when I didn't know you were not to be taken seriously, I told you I was raised Catholic. Yet you refuse to confirm or deny your assertions as Geltman and Goldman that you are jewish.

So you know about me, yet say nothing about you. You ask plenty of questions, most of them irrelevant, but refuse to answer any. What's the deal, "KG"? Are you no man at all?

http://goldismoney.info/forums/showpost.php?p=888605&postcount=1

Still waiting for you to be a little man there, KG.

[johngr]

Do you know what Stay On Topic means ?

Yes, it means you know there's no glib answer for my question (that Ulysses brought up by mentioning dancing Mossad agents) and you wish it would go away.

Yes, it means something I can find nowhere in the GIM rules and which internet discussions often tend not to do.

Yes, it means WHO TF ARE YOU?

[Pax]

We already conclusively DEBUNKED the 5 dancing Israeli Mossad agent MYTH. That was weeks ago, you must have missed it.

For the record so that we arent repeating ourselves here, we have conclusively debunked:

Free fall collapse myth

5 Dancing Israelis

Explosives in towers/building 7.

What is next?

[Large Sarge]

We already conclusively DEBUNKED the 5 dancing Israeli Mossad agent MYTH. That was weeks ago, you must have missed it.

For the record so that we arent repeating ourselves here, we have conclusively debunked:

Free fall collapse myth

5 Dancing Israelis

Explosives in towers/building 7.

What is next?

You debunked it with you great mental abilities, you have shown that kerosene can in fact melt steel.

by Kevin Ryan
Underwriters Laboratories
Thursday, Nov 11, 2004

The following letter was sent today by Kevin Ryan of Underwriters Laboratories (http://www.ul.com/) to Frank Gayle of the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) (http://www.nist.gov/). Underwriters Laboratories is the company that certified the steel componets used in the constuction of the World Trade Center towers. The information in this letter is of great importance.

Dr. Gayle,

Having recently reviewed your team's report of 10/19/04, I felt the need to contact you directly.

As I'm sure you know, the company I work for certified the steel components used in the construction of the WTC buildings. In requesting information from both our CEO and Fire Protection business manager last year, I learned that they did not agree on the essential aspects of the story, except for one thing - that the samples we certified met all requirements. They suggested we all be patient and understand that UL was working with your team, and that tests would continue through this year. I'm aware of UL's attempts to help, including performing tests on models of the floor assemblies. But the results of these tests appear to indicate that the buildings should have easily withstood the thermal stress caused by pools of burning jet fuel.

There continues to be a number of "experts" making public claims about how the WTC buildings fell. One such person, Dr. Hyman Brown from the WTC construction crew, claims that the buildings collapsed due to fires at 2000F melting the steel (1). He states "What caused the building to collapse is the airplane fuel…burning at 2,000 degrees Fahrenheit. The steel in that five-floor area melts." Additionally, the newspaper that quotes him says "Just-released preliminary findings from a National Institute of Standards and Technology study of the World Trade Center collapse support Brown’s theory."

We know that the steel components were certified to ASTM E119. The time temperature curves for this standard require the samples to be exposed to temperatures around 2000F for several hours. And as we all agree, the steel applied met those specifications. Additionally, I think we can all agree that even un-fireproofed steel will not melt until reaching red-hot temperatures of nearly 3000F (2). Why Dr. Brown would imply that 2000F would melt the high-grade steel used in those buildings makes no sense at all.

The results of your recently published metallurgical tests seem to clear things up (3), and support your team's August 2003 update as detailed by the Associated Press (4), in which you were ready to "rule out weak steel as a contributing factor in the collapse." The evaluation of paint deformation and spheroidization seem very straightforward, and you noted that the samples available were adequate for the investigation. Your comments suggest that the steel was probably exposed to temperatures of only about 500F (250C), which is what one might expect from a thermodynamic analysis of the situation.

However the summary of the new NIST report seems to ignore your findings, as it suggests that these low temperatures caused exposed bits of the building’s steel core to "soften and buckle." (5) Additionally this summary states that the perimeter columns softened, yet your findings make clear that "most perimeter panels (157 of 160) saw no temperature above 250C." To soften steel for the purposes of forging, normally temperatures need to be above1100C (6). However, this new summary report suggests that much lower temperatures were be able to not only soften the steel in a matter of minutes, but lead to rapid structural collapse.

This story just does not add up. If steel from those buildings did soften or melt, I’m sure we can all agree that this was certainly not due to jet fuel fires of any kind, let alone the briefly burning fires in those towers. That fact should be of great concern to all Americans. Alternatively, the contention that this steel did fail at temperatures around 250C suggests that the majority of deaths on 9/11 were due to a safety-related failure. That suggestion should be of great concern to my company.

There is no question that the events of 9/11 are the emotional driving force behind the War on Terror. And the issue of the WTC collapse is at the crux of the story of 9/11. My feeling is that your metallurgical tests are at the crux of the crux of the crux. Either you can make sense of what really happened to those buildings, and communicate this quickly, or we all face the same destruction and despair that come from global decisions based on disinformation and “chatter”.

Thanks for your efforts to determine what happened on that day. You may know that there are a number of other current and former government employees that have risked a great deal to help us to know the truth. I've copied one of these people on this message as a sign of respect and support. I believe your work could also be a nucleus of fact around which the truth, and thereby global peace and justice, can grow again. Please do what you can to quickly eliminate the confusion regarding the ability of jet fuel fires to soften or melt structural steel.

1. http://www.boulderweekly.com/archive/102104/coverstory.html 2. CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics, 61st edition, pg D-187 3. http://wtc.nist.gov/media/P3MechanicalandMetAnalysisofSteel.pdf 4. http://www.voicesofsept11.org/archive/911ic/082703.php 5. http://wtc.nist.gov/media/NCSTACWTCStatusFINAL101904WEB2.pdf (pg 11) 6. http://www.forging.org/FIERF/pdf/ffaaMacSleyne.pdf

Kevin Ryan

[Kahlil Gibran]

5 Dancing Israelis

They seem to be dancing all over these GIM 9-11 threads lately.

:haha:

[johngr]

We already conclusively DEBUNKED the 5 dancing Israeli Mossad agent MYTH. That was weeks ago, you must have missed it.

For the record so that we arent repeating ourselves here, we have conclusively debunked:

Free fall collapse myth

5 Dancing Israelis

Explosives in towers/building 7.

What is next?

Your "debunking" itself is bunk (as usual).

And you have no explanation for this because there is none (none that is plausible, anyway): http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/mex.html.

[mactheknf]

Yes, it means you know there's no glib answer for my question (that Ulysses brought up by mentioning dancing Mossad agents) and you wish it would go away.

Yes, it means something I can find nowhere in the GIM rules and which internet discussions often tend not to do.

Yes, it means WHO TF ARE YOU?


It means I know how to stay on topic, genius.

[johngr]

It means I know how to stay on topic, genius.

So when did the topic change to "staying on topic"?

BTW, what where Mossad agents with pistols, explosives and detonators doing in the Mexican Parliament one month after the WTC attacks?

[mactheknf]

The Topic; What brought the towers down???

Check the poll for possible answers the author was looking for ...

[Pax]

You debunked it with you great mental abilities, you have shown that kerosene can in fact melt steel.

I dont have to debunk melted steel because you have never shown me any evidence of melted steel, Melted METAL does not have to mean melted steel, in fact we know there was melted aluminum so that is likely your melted MELTALS that you boy Kevin Ryan is speaking of.


Seeing red hot steel girders makes sense since they used cutting torches to remove debris.

[blueice]

Again, throwing a rock while accusing someone else of throwing a rock.

Where in any of my posts am I "defending Henry Kissinger" doing anything? As to Kevin MacDonald, how does the fact that I posted his wiki profile constitute slander? Now you've repeatedly demonstrated yourself to be the liar.

As to who I am, at least the first time you asked, back when I didn't know you were not to be taken seriously, I told you I was raised Catholic. Yet you refuse to confirm or deny your assertions as Geltman and Goldman that you are jewish.

So you know about me, yet say nothing about you. You ask plenty of questions, most of them irrelevant, but refuse to answer any. What's the deal, "KG"? Are you no man at all?

Ulysses, have you notice that when you catch Master KG with his pants down, he never comes out of the out-house....:bull-smile:

[Ulysses]

Ulysses, have you notice that when you catch Master KG with his pants down, he never comes out of the out-house....:bull-smile:


Indeed... that would also explain the smell!

:D

[Kahlil Gibran]

Ulysses, have you notice that when you catch Master KG with his pants down, he never comes out of the out-house....:bull-smile:

Indeed... that would also explain the smell!

:D

:smokin: Amazing how Chewy was banned today. Amazing.

[Ulysses]

Nice try KG, but the fact is that you constantly insult and attack other people, ask all kinds of personal questions and refuse to answer any clearly and honestly.

[Kahlil Gibran]

Nice try KG

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v700/skyluslondon/polite.jpg

:wavey:

[Noble]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v700/skyluslondon/polite.jpg

:wavey:


Oh yea of little intelligent response. What are you, 15 or 16 years old?

Grow up.

[Kahlil Gibran]

Oh yea of little intelligent response.

http://goldismoney.info/forums/showpost.php?p=888981&postcount=568

[decebal]

And then at the Pentagon the invisible plane that went in to the black hole that measured 4x8 and left no traces behind.



it's stupid comments like that that makes it difficult to believe any of the other 'thoeries' on 911 attacks.
your talking bullshit if you spend 10 seconds googling you will find images of plane wreckage.
http://www.oilempire.us/pentagon-photos.html
although i can't find the site for now, I have also seen images of the dead passengers still in their seats.

as the rest of the world know america is the home of the conspiracy nuts :confused_ma:.
as we say only in America :)

a bit more education and less religion and America can join reality and the 21st century

merry xmas

[wrs]

although i can't find the site for now, I have also seen images of the dead passengers still in their seats.


Really, you must have been there and then been resurrected because such pictures do not and have not ever existed. You are either a lunatic or a liar. I suspect the latter. Not one piece of DNA of any purported individual on any plane from that day has ever surfaced. The only thing they ever found was Mohammed Atta's passport in pristine condition on the sidewalk after the collapse fo the WTC, like that is believable. Yep, about as believable as your images......................

linky please?

[mactheknf]

Really, you must have been there and then been resurrected because such pictures do not and have not ever existed. You are either a lunatic or a liar. I suspect the latter. Not one piece of DNA of any purported individual on any plane from that day has ever surfaced. The only thing they ever found was Mohammed Atta's passport in pristine condition on the sidewalk after the collapse fo the WTC, like that is believable. Yep, about as believable as your images......................

linky please?



Before you go shooting your mouth off calling people "liars and/or lunitics" maybe you should think about your own statements.



"Families of the airplanes' passengers and crews and those who died within the Pentagon provided DNA samples, typically on toothbrushes or hairbrushes, to aid with identification. ...... , said Chris Kelly, spokesman for the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology, which did the DNA work."

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/08/17/attack/main519033.shtml

"About 53% of the remains that could be identified were matched through DNA analysis alone."

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-09-11-sept11-remains_x.htm




You live in a glass house.

[rodin]

I have also seen images of the dead passengers still in their seats.

Do you have a link for that? never heard of such a thing