northwest territorial mint

[lhslancers3270]

Has anyone dealt with this company. I see they are cheaper than everybody else on junk bag by about 200 bucks shipping and insurance. Anyone have any experience with them?

[IrishGold]

IIRC, tinysbro was hyping them when he first joined GIM

[Halophyte]

I made a small lot purchase of 10 oz bars from them last year, they seem to be honest and fair priced at the time but I've moved on to trade rounds and 90% since then. Hope this helps.

PS, the bars are sharp and fancy designed too. For what that's worth.


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[rural_ghetto]

I have purchased about 100 ounces of silver from them. Their shipping is a little slower than some other places, but it is worth the low prices if you ask me.

Also, the rounds and bars they mint are of pretty good quality.

[Golden Half]

Their web site doesn't
explain their shipping charges.
Anyone know about it?
Or is the shipping already included into the price?

TIA

G/2

[tinysbro]

[QUOTE=Golden Half]Their web site doesn't
explain their shipping charges.
Anyone know about it?
Or is the shipping already included into the price? :wavey: The site does say that the price includes shipping & insurance on silver. I think they could tell you that they are a little slow because they have to make your bars!

[Chaps]

Hi all, new poster here, nice site.

NWTM includes ship & insur as far as I know. I live in the greater Seattle area and they discount the price if you local delivery. It's a pretty good sized outfit.

[QUOTE=Golden Half]Their web site doesn't
explain their shipping charges.
Anyone know about it?
Or is the shipping already included into the price? :wavey: The site does say that the price includes shipping & insurance on silver. I think they could tell you that they are a little slow because they have to make your bars!

[tinysbro]

Hi all, new poster here, nice site.

NWTM includes ship & insur as far as I know. I live in the greater Seattle area and they discount the price if you take delivery at their plant. They also have their own trucks that deliver at no charge which is what I take advantage of. Just ordered some 90% bags to be dropped off at my bank. It's a pretty good sized outfit. :tongue: I was wondering are they slow with the 90% like the bars? I have only bought the bars from them but I was thinking about a bag or two and would be not want to wait so long!

[tinysbro]

:tongue: I was wondering are they slow with the 90% like the bars? I have only bought the bars from them but I was thinking about a bag or two and would be not want to wait so long! :sleep: Welcome aboard Chaps!!!

[Chaps]

Thanks for the welcome! I guess I need to find a cool graphic for my posts?

On your question about NWTM shipping, I don't know if or why they might be slow getting various items out the door on commercial carriers. I call them to see if they have 90% (they usually do) . . . I think the key if you are not closeby is to verify they have what you want when you call, verify (fix) the price, verify ship date, place the order, send them a check, get the shipping info and start tracking it. I don't buy very often, just when balancing out a portfolio that I decided years ago to have a portion of in on-hand metals (and that's about all the thought I've put into it). I've learned a bunch reading the posts on this site - wow - you folks have elevated this PM stuff into an art form and I can see it's fun to discuss various aspect of it.

:sleep: Welcome aboard Chaps!!!

[lhslancers]

How about this one? :haha:

[Chaps]

How about this one? :haha:

Hey, that guy looks just like me - is he famous? :bath:

[rural_ghetto]

I want to make it clear that when I said they were slow, I wasn't trying to discourage anyone from buying from them. I purchased my bullion with a personal check, and they were very clear on their website and on the telephone that there is a delay while they wait for the check to clear. You have to use a money order or cashier's check for fast shipment.

I plan to do business with them in the future. It is hard to find prices that low unless you are buying huge quantities.

[PatColo]

Rightly or wrongly, I've resisted posting this PM-consumer FYI before today. However, yesterday's events have pushed this situation with Northwest Territorial Mint well beyond the charitable "doesn't pass the smell test" description.

I'll have to work to keep this story to an easily digestable length, which will mean sparing you the reader every small detail. But I do have every relevant correspondence re this situation documented in bank records, emails and in audio-recorded phone calls. I will post all this text and audio to a dedicated website should this situation continue deteriorating on its present course.

Four weeks ago, on Tuesday July 6 2004, I placed a large bullion order with NWTM. Invoice 26559-B, totalling >$125,000. I was a first-time customer. I'd recently cashed out of some real estate, I'd done my research, and decided hands-on PMs were where to be (again, humbly, "rightly or wrongly"). Four elements to the order: 1 oz NWTM-minted .995 palladium medalions, 1 oz NWTM-minted .995 palladium "bars", 1 oz NWTM-minted .999 silver rounds, and ten 90% "junk-silver bags".

I arranged the wire transfer of the entire balance in "good funds" the next day, Wednesday 7/7; and the transfer took place on Thursday 7/8 to NWTM's bank "Mt. Ranier National Bank" (ABA #125108159, Account # 0490306401). The NWTM sales rep I'd worked with, whose name I'll spare from the internet search engines and instead leave at the initials "KP", verified via email on the afternoon of 7/8 that they had indeed received my payment.

Based on the verbal phone back-and-forth, and on NWTM's website (http://www.nwtmintbullion.com/ToOrder.htm) which reads "Upon receipt of your cashier's check or money order, we will process your order and ship it via registered insured mail or UPS. Personal checks are welcome, but there will be a 10 day waiting period on receipt of the check before your order is shipped", and based on the allegedly robust size of NWTM's organization; I had (naively?) assumed that, with my good-funds wire tranfer of payment-in-full, I'd have physical possesion of my full purchase within a week. "KP" never piped up to the contrary, even knowing the size of my order and in double-checking that I had their money-wiring instructions correct.

So here is where I have to make a long story short. Four full weeks after placing this order, & 26 days after wiring good funds payment in full, NWTM has not shipped squat. Recall, this is 100% common bullion coins, nothing custom minted.

My first inquiry of KP was 4 days after wiring funds, as they hadn't advised me anything re shipping, providing tracking numbers as promised, etc. KP replied that it would begin shipping that week, they'd let me know. The week passed, with silence from NWTM. Every few days for the next 2 weeks, I had to proactively inquire as to what was happening, since NWTM was consistently silent when their latest promised shipping time frame would come and go. Each time, KP would tell me another variation of "it'll ship this week, I'll email you tracking numbers, apologies for the delay".

A week ago today, Tuesday July 27, marked the end of 3 full weeks of this carrot-and-stick nonsense. I called and spoke with NWTM CEO Ross Hansen, to get to the bottom of it. Ross was all apologies, blah blah, he allegedly did some checking around and he assured me that it would definately begin shipping tomorrow, aka Wed 7/28. Wed came and went with the usual silence from NWTM. Thursday 7/29 I emailed CCing Ross and KP, asking what was happening. Silence. Friday I send 2 more emails to Ross and KP. You guessed it: SILENCE.

Yesterday 8/2 I call to speak to Ross again. Receptionist tells me he's on a conference call with accounting and would return my call. Four hours later I've heard nothing. It's 3:30 PST and I call again. Receptionist tells me I'm on Ross' call-back list and will definately hear from him by 5PM PST. Yeppers, silence. The "black hole" of the past 4 weeks just grew a whole lot blacker.

So this is where my NWTM nightmare stands at this point. Still developing of course, and I'll come back and update as things happen. But readers need to be advised, something is very, very wrong at Northwest Territorial Mint presently. You do not want to be in this situation. It's scary. Today I need to aquire legal counsel to find out how best to proceed.

Any advice from readers is also appreciated.

[Orson]

I am also waiting for a shipment from NWT that is more than one month overdue. My order was small. Anytime I am a new customer, I place a small order first and ramp up my order size slowly to judge their responsiveness. (I realize this advice is a little too late for you.)

I was patient with my first two inquiries, but after I was promised a third delivery date, I changed from an inquisitive "What is the status of my order?" to a request "Please give me the tracking number for my shipment" I always remained cheerful and polite, but I realize that this may not be possible with the order size that you are dealing with. Eventually, I was promised a tracking number, which I received four business days later.

I don't see any other dealer with as many complaints as NWT in this forum. I had to see for myself and can verify that I am also not impressed.

[tinysbro]

Rightly or wrongly, I've resisted posting this PM-consumer FYI before today. However, yesterday's events have pushed this situation with Northwest Territorial Mint well beyond the charitable "doesn't pass the smell test" description.

I'll have to work to keep this story to an easily digestable length, which will mean sparing you the reader every small detail. But I do have every relevant correspondence re this situation documented in bank records, emails and in audio-recorded phone calls. I will post all this text and audio to a dedicated website should this situation continue deteriorating on its present course.

Four weeks ago, on Tuesday July 6 2004, I placed a large bullion order with NWTM. Invoice 26559-B, totalling >$125,000. I was a first-time customer. I'd recently cashed out of some real estate, I'd done my research, and decided hands-on PMs were where to be (again, humbly, "rightly or wrongly"). Four elements to the order: 1 oz NWTM-minted .995 palladium medalions, 1 oz NWTM-minted .995 palladium "bars", 1 oz NWTM-minted .999 silver rounds, and ten 90% "junk-silver bags".

I arranged the wire transfer of the entire balance in "good funds" the next day, Wednesday 7/7; and the transfer took place on Thursday 7/8 to NWTM's bank "Mt. Ranier National Bank" (ABA #125108159, Account # 0490306401). The NWTM sales rep I'd worked with, whose name I'll spare from the internet search engines and instead leave at the initials "KP", verified via email on the afternoon of 7/8 that they had indeed received my payment.

Based on the verbal phone back-and-forth, and on NWTM's website (http://www.nwtmintbullion.com/ToOrder.htm) which reads "Upon receipt of your cashier's check or money order, we will process your order and ship it via registered insured mail or UPS. Personal checks are welcome, but there will be a 10 day waiting period on receipt of the check before your order is shipped", and based on the allegedly robust size of NWTM's organization; I had (naively?) assumed that, with my good-funds wire tranfer of payment-in-full, I'd have physical possesion of my full purchase within a week. "KP" never piped up to the contrary, even knowing the size of my order and in double-checking that I had their money-wiring instructions correct.

So here is where I have to make a long story short. Four full weeks after placing this order, & 26 days after wiring good funds payment in full, NWTM has not shipped squat. Recall, this is 100% common bullion coins, nothing custom minted.

My first inquiry of KP was 4 days after wiring funds, as they hadn't advised me anything re shipping, providing tracking numbers as promised, etc. KP replied that it would begin shipping that week, they'd let me know. The week passed, with silence from NWTM. Every few days for the next 2 weeks, I had to proactively inquire as to what was happening, since NWTM was consistently silent when their latest promised shipping time frame would come and go. Each time, KP would tell me another variation of "it'll ship this week, I'll email you tracking numbers, apologies for the delay".

A week ago today, Tuesday July 27, marked the end of 3 full weeks of this carrot-and-stick nonsense. I called and spoke with NWTM CEO Ross Hansen, to get to the bottom of it. Ross was all apologies, blah blah, he allegedly did some checking around and he assured me that it would definately begin shipping tomorrow, aka Wed 7/28. Wed came and went with the usual silence from NWTM. Thursday 7/29 I emailed CCing Ross and KP, asking what was happening. Silence. Friday I send 2 more emails to Ross and KP. You guessed it: SILENCE.

Yesterday 8/2 I call to speak to Ross again. Receptionist tells me he's on a conference call with accounting and would return my call. Four hours later I've heard nothing. It's 3:30 PST and I call again. Receptionist tells me I'm on Ross' call-back list and will definately hear from him by 5PM PST. Yeppers, silence. The "black hole" of the past 4 weeks just grew a whole lot blacker.

So this is where my NWTM nightmare stands at this point. Still developing of course, and I'll come back and update as things happen. But readers need to be advised, something is very, very wrong at Northwest Territorial Mint presently. You do not want to be in this situation. It's scary. Today I need to aquire legal counsel to find out how best to proceed.

Any advice from readers is also appreciated.I would say you will get your order. That is some order. I have heard from one large buyer that at times a month is not long to wait. That he had (at times) big problems finding what he wants to buy and he does business with the biggest sellers. They (NWTM) stalled me one time for like 6 weeks on a small order. I don't think anyone has posted that they did not get their order. They are famously slow. I think at least one person there lies.

[Bobcat]

PatColo,

The same situation (different dealer) brought me here, I know what you are going through.

I think you will receive your metals, but maybe a call to the U.S. Attorney General in Washington State may be in order. If the dealer has not sent the metals within 30 days, you can file a complaint.

The owner of Southern Coin and Precious Metals (good guy) told me about a situation he had one time with a mixup on a gold order. The customer had not received his order within 30 days and filed with the AG. Within 3 days of the customer filing, the FBI showed at SCPM and were going to arrest the owner if he couldn't prove he had sent the gold. He had sent it and the situation was resolved, but he definitely felt the heat.

I'm sure your imagination is working overtime (mine was) and there is nothing you can do about that, receiving your order is the only remedy.

Best of luck to you and keep us posted.

Bobcat

[tinysbro]

At this time I would not pay a lawyer but for one phone call (if that) knowing how slow they are.

[PatColo]

Thanks for the replies and encouragement. I just registered this handle last night, still figuring out the structure of these boards. I found this thread as it was the 7th hit in googling "Northwest Territorial Mint" (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=Northwest+Territorial+Mint&btnG=Search). But I've since posted it as a new thread HERE (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?p=58816#post58816). I've posted an update there regarding what (hasn't) happened today, and I'll look to post updates to that thread. The imagination does work its magic in a situation like this, unhelped by the chain of broken promises and AWOL status of NWTM personnel lately including the CEO. But you know every time we turn around the media's blabbering on again about how al-CIAda could stage another fake terrorist attack any minute now, be afraid, but keep shopping, blah blah. I think the odds are there will be another fake ter'st attack before Nov though, & who knows after TSHTF what things will look like for UPS, USPS etc for awhile afterwards, so I'd just assume get the PMs in hand without undue delay. And that means, no more wasting time playing pattycakes with NWTM.

[baygoldbug]

PatColo, my recent experience with NWTM is veeery similar to yours.

I placed a sizable order on 7/13. When I placed the order, I was told that it would be shipped within 10 days. On 7/27, after 2 weeks of not hearing from them, I called and the receptionist referred me to the bullion specialist, Kyle. She said Kyle was on the phone, but would return my call shortly. Kyle did not return my call. I called the next day and was again told that Kyle was on the phone and would call me back. I advised the receptionist that Kyle had not returned my call from the previous day. She put me on hold and said that Kyle told her that I would receive an e-mail that my order would be shipping on 7/29.

On 8/2, I had not received the bullion, or an e-mail of shipment or even a return call from Kyle. I called and the receptionist, yet again, told me that I needed to speak to Kyle but he was on another phone call. I reminded the receptionist of our previous contacts and advised her that I was getting very uncomfortable with not yet receiving my order. She referrred me to the owner (Mintmaster) Ross Hansen.

Mr. Hansen advised me that silver shipments to them had been slow and many orders were on hold until they receive the next shipment. He said that they would definitely be receiving 40,000 oz of refined silver on 8/11. It will be stamped into rounds and buillion bars on 8/12 and shipped on 8/13 (Friday the 13th).

If our orders are not shipped by 8/16, we may have some significant reason for concern.
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[Kodie]

Sheesh! 590 thousand line reply lost in the posting process, I ain't typing it again! (You guys are saved!)

Bottom line, I dealt with NWTM in 2000 with positive results. Good people. Took a while, but I never doubted for a second that I might get beat out of my investment. However, if I had 125K on the line, I might invest in an airline ticket and meet for a face to face. Find out for shure!

[Blue_pill_envy]

I sent these guys money (bank transfer) for a silver oder on July 15.
I was told my order would go out in 3 days....
I called again, and was told orders usually ship within 10 days....
After that it was very difficult to contact anyone.
Last Friday, I was told by the owner my shipment would go out on Tues. (2 days ago). As of yet I haven't received any e-mail that says it went out.

Maybe these guys are legit, but their service is awful. I'll wait another couple days and then contact the Washington AG office (already spoke to them). I'll let you know what happens.........

[baygoldbug]

I called Ross Hansen (Mintmaster) yesterday to confirm that the 40,000 oz shipment of silver was recieved. i was told that he was at lunch (10:00 am) and that he would return my call within the hour. By the end of the day, no call.

Today I called again to Mr. Hansen and was told that he was on a telephone call and would return my call later. I advised the receptionist that he did not return my call yesterday. In addition, I advised her that nobody had returned any of my promised telephone calls.

Since Mr. Ross was not available, I asked to speak to Kyle or Christina (in the bullion department). I was told that they were both in a closed conference with Mr. Ross and were unavailable. I was told that one of them would return my call shortly.
By the end of the business day, today.................. NO CALL !!!!

If 4-6 weeks was the normal processing period for the NWTM, it seems as though it would be more professional for them to disclose this at the time of the transaction. The smoke and mirrors deceptions and the shell game tactics are not reassuring.

- BGB
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[Bullionaire]

What is the latest on this situation?

[Halophyte]

Buy now and get shipment by New Years !!!


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[Joejeweler]

Sorry guys,.......but this situation is total CRAP! Inexcusable to have such time lags from reciept of good funds till shipment of metal. This company should not be taking folks money without full disclosure, and i suspect may be playing with the money possibly hoping to replace the metals at a lower price and making up for that "low" draw-me-in price.

Here i have been busting my A$$ on my Ebay Store getting folks silver mailed IMMEDIATELY after good funds have cleared, and in the case of Bank Check or Money Order i ship THAT SAME DAY! (mostly 1964 dated Kennedy 90% Uncirculated halves for now since the 11 100 Ounce Engelhards i had sold out).

I spend a lot of time getting them packaged to save THE CUSTOMER in shipping costs, and take the heat from my local Post Offices by sending out these HEAVY 5-7 pound packages in Flat Rate Priority Envelopes. They are safe, (Insured), but a bit of a pain to open for the buyer. (but that's what you want!)

For a few repeat customers i have even shipped upon reciept of a personal check when i am reasonably confident in the character of the customer. Often i will make a special trip to post a single item, as i know i would expect that if i were buying. This whole situation is making me really angry, :angry: ......and it can only be a fraction of the anger for those actually involved! (THANK GOD FOR MY LOCAL DEALER!!!)

I'd be on a plane so fast for $125K you wouldn't believe it. Then straight to the local FBI office with all my paperwork and then rent a car and PICK UP whatever metal i could in person,(even if it wasn't exactly what i had ordered but was available)......and deduct the shipping cost thank you! (would help to offset the plane and car rental)

......Rant over,.....and i hope it all works out. But this has got to stop happening with this company or close them down. :thumpdown

[90%RealMoney]

Sorry guys,.......but this situation is total CRAP! Inexcusable to have such time lags from reciept of good funds till shipment of metal. This company should not be taking folks money without full disclosure, and i suspect may be playing with the money possibly hoping to replace the metals at a lower price and making up for that "low" draw-me-in price.

Here i have been busting my A$$ on my Ebay Store getting folks silver mailed IMMEDIATELY after good funds have cleared, and in the case of Bank Check or Money Order i ship THAT SAME DAY! (mostly 1964 dated Kennedy 90% Uncirculated halves for now since the 11 100 Ounce Engelhards i had sold out).

I spend a lot of time getting them packaged to save THE CUSTOMER in shipping costs, and take the heat from my local Post Offices by sending out these HEAVY 5-7 pound packages in Flat Rate Priority Envelopes. They are safe, (Insured), but a bit of a pain to open for the buyer. (but that's what you want!)

For a few repeat customers i have even shipped upon reciept of a personal check when i am reasonably confident in the character of the customer. Often i will make a special trip to post a single item, as i know i would expect that if i were buying. This whole situation is making me really angry, :angry: ......and it can only be a fraction of the anger for those actually involved! (THANK GOD FOR MY LOCAL DEALER!!!)

I'd be on a plane so fast for $125K you wouldn't believe it. Then straight to the local FBI office with all my paperwork and then rent a car and PICK UP whatever metal i could in person,(even if it wasn't exactly what i had ordered but was available)......and deduct the shipping cost thank you! (would help to offset the plane and car rental)

......Rant over,.....and i hope it all works out. But this has got to stop happening with this company or close them down. :thumpdown
Joe, your a man after my own heart! I had two auctions for $100.00 face 90% bags end this morning. The buyers paid via pay pal, and the bags were in the mail this afternoon. I was thinking the same thing as I was taping the shit out of the flat rate envelopes, "I'm working my ass off to save the customers shipping charges"! Oh well, I'm sure some of these people will appreciate the service enough to be repeat customers. I sent a guy a postal money order 3-1/2 weeks ago for 4 rolls of silver eagles, and I haven't seen jack yet! This guy gets the rolls to everyone, but is REALLY slow. He doesn't seem to care about getting, or giving negative feedback either. He won't last. I still have one of those nice shiny Northwest Territorial 10 ounce bars. Maybe I'll keep it for a souvenir! Sounds like they might not be around much longer either!

[Joejeweler]

Hehehe,.........at least i'm not alone. I was beginning to think i was doing something WRONG by offering top notch service! Might not make much on each sale either,......but i hope to be around a long time, and make a few friends along the way......

......sounds good to me. :coolbeer:

[Joejeweler]

......Oh, forgot to mention i got a notice from my Postal Clerk this Morning about the taping of those Flat Rate Priority Mail Envelopes. Previously i was "told" that as long as the envelope would close on it's own you could add tape along the edges. This worked for me because i use that small priority box and double face tape it to the inside if the envelope along the bottom and both sides. Even IF the envelope opened it wouldn't fall out. Adding double faced tape to the inside of the sealing flap can't hurt either! :haha:

However,.....this morning i recieved a PRINTED notice to the effect that they don't want the SIDES taped anymore. (BUT, you could add tape to the sealing flap to re-inforce it!)

Seems they deem the sides to have "burst" if you have to add re-inforcement to the edges to keep it from bursting in the first place. What????? Funny that ONLY on this one product are all kinds of stipulations being made (and changed on a regular basis!), in effect trying to prevent folks from taking advantage of the service's main draw........ANY weight goes!
Other packages the Post Office encourages generous amounts of tape and re-inforcement.

......not to worry, however,.......as i already plan on adding the same fibre tape re-inforcement to the INSIDE of those side seams! Might be tricky to get it in there, and i'll probably have to make a special tool to do it neatly,....but i will get it done!

.......those Postal Service Flunkies aren't going to get me on this one! :D

[Halophyte]

Joejeweler & 90%RealMoney

I've bought a little physical at e-bay over the last couple of years but I've been so worried about the tranactions or getting ripped off. This keeps me running to the big on-line dealers with big on-line markups and the postage is ..... well, whatever.

I tried one sale on e-bay too (10 bars). It went south because some stupid doctor (thaty's right an MD no less) couldn't read simple directions and busted the deal by sending me a bloody personal check three weeks later. What a moron. That was during the top of the last big swing up, and guess what ? We got hit by the CRIMEX after that. I was severely POed.

I know the crap you guys go through at e-bay. Hope you guys get your metals worth.



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